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Topic: Football Trivia
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catmandoo
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posted 01-23-2012 10:16 AM
Name the last coach with a winning record at Kentucky and the years that he coached.
[ 01-23-2012, 10:17 AM: Message edited by: catmandoo ]
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boomdaddy
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posted 01-23-2012 01:06 PM
Blanton Collier? Before my time...Or was it my favorite coach Fran Curci of the mid 70s?
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Trey Ball
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posted 01-23-2012 01:40 PM
No clue, but I know who it isn't:
Joker Phillips
Rich Brooks
Guy Morriss
Hal Mumme
Bill Curry
Jerry Claiborne
I'm pretty sure that none of those coaches have had a career winning record while at UK. Those are the coaches that I can remember coaching the Cats.
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Wife's Mad. Told me we never talk anymore. And just last nite while watching super bowl told her 2 or 3 times to get me a coke and popcorn. Also told her not to forget to take out trash in the morning. Ain't that something. Also told me I was too indecisive. Can't figure out what to do about that. One nice thing I guess. She called me a pro crastinator. Don't know what a crastinator is but I guess I'm a good one for her to call me a pro. Gonna wait til tomorrow to look that up though. I love her but somrtimes can't help but thinking I should have told uncle Junior to keep his coon hound pup and stevens double barrel and also his youngest daughter.
redbone
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catmandoo
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posted 01-23-2012 06:00 PM
Trey you can add Charle Bradshaw to your list too. The last coach with a winning record was Blanton Collier in 1961.
The point is Phillips has coached for a couple of years and many fans on this board want him tarred and feathered already. We haven't had a coach with a winning record for over 50 years, yes 50 long years.
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Trey Ball
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posted 01-23-2012 06:17 PM
cmd,
I never even heard of Bradshaw or Collier. The first UK football coach that I could remember was Claiborne. I remember him taking UK to maybe the Hall of Fame game around 1983 or 1984. I think UK played Wisconsin or Minnesota, but I could be wrong on the Bowl Game and the opponent. I think here in Northern Indiana that Bowl Game was the first time that UK Football had ever been on TV so I could watch.
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Wife's Mad. Told me we never talk anymore. And just last nite while watching super bowl told her 2 or 3 times to get me a coke and popcorn. Also told her not to forget to take out trash in the morning. Ain't that something. Also told me I was too indecisive. Can't figure out what to do about that. One nice thing I guess. She called me a pro crastinator. Don't know what a crastinator is but I guess I'm a good one for her to call me a pro. Gonna wait til tomorrow to look that up though. I love her but somrtimes can't help but thinking I should have told uncle Junior to keep his coon hound pup and stevens double barrel and also his youngest daughter.
redbone
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catmandoo
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posted 01-23-2012 07:05 PM
Trey, i bet you were not even born 50 years ago when Bradshaw was the head coach. That's what makes this so crazy. It's been that long since we had a coach with a winning record and they want Joker fired for 2 seasons without a winning record!
To give you an idea on what a car looked like in 1961 here is a picture of one. It's a Desoto and i doubt if you can even remember a Desoto. I know Norm and i can. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
[ 01-23-2012, 07:11 PM: Message edited by: catmandoo ]
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Wildcat Bill
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posted 01-23-2012 07:07 PM
Trey, just to educate you a little. Blanton Collier was a native of Paris, KY and played at Georgetown College, I think. Somehow, he got to be Paul Brown's chief assistant coach of the Cleveland Browns in the early 50s when they were winning NFL championships right and left. When Bear Bryant abruptly left UK for Texas A&M, UK hired Collier. He did pretty well, but following Bryant would be tough for anyone. He did assemble some awesome coaching staffs. One picture of the UK staff, in the late 1950s I think, had his assistant coaches pictured who included Don Shula, Chuck Knox, Bill Arnsparger, all later NFL head coaches. When Collier was fired (they bought up his contract) in about 1961, he returned to the Browns and succeeded Paul Brown as the head coach in 1963. A year later, his Browns won the 1964 NFL Championship (this was just before they decided to have the Super Bowl) with a Browns team featuring Jim Brown, Gary Collins, and Paul Warfield. They shut out Shula's Baltimore Colts 27-0 in the final game. I believe that is still the last professional sports championship team from Cleveland.
Charlie Bradshaw had played for Bear Bryant at UK and was his top assistant at Alabama. UK hired him. He was brutal, by all accounts, and had about one good season before he got fired as well in 1968.
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Tiptree
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posted 01-24-2012 07:50 AM
Whoever was the AD during the 50's and 60's did us no favors. Letting Bryant walk away, and then firing Collier -- and that staff! -- rightfully put a black flag on UKs name from that point onward. 50+ years of 'bad luck' (i.e., the inability to attract top-nothc coaches and players) ensued.
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“If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.” Thomas Jefferson
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Wildcat Bill
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posted 01-24-2012 06:16 PM
The UK AD during the 50s and 60s was Bernie Shively. Bear Bryant just suddenly up and left UK. I don't think it was ever definitively known why, many think that it was a rivalry with Coach Rupp and the Bear just didn't want to have to play second fiddle to him. After all, during this period, UK won 3 NCAA championships and this was the golden age of UK basketball (or at least tied with 1996-1998). There may have been other personal reasons as well, not having to do with UK. Whatever the reason for Bryant's departure from UK, I don't think that Shively just "let him walk away". He just left by his own will.
As for Blanton Collier, he started out very well but towards the end, he had several losing seasons. Back then, with Bear Bryant and then with Blanton Collier early (his first year was 7-3 I think), UK was used to winning in football had certainly not become accustomed to losing, like we are now, so firing the coach seemed to be the only way. Plus, I think he thought that he was getting Bear Bryant lite in Charlie Bradshaw, not only a UK alum but also Bryant's top assistant at Alabama. He sure was wrong on that one.
[ 01-25-2012, 07:24 PM: Message edited by: Wildcat Bill ]
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SCWC
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posted 01-31-2012 10:10 AM
After the 1951 season UK had won the National Championship in Basketball and Bear Bryant had won the Sugar Bowl in football. UK gave Rupp a new cadillac for winning his third National Championship and gave Bear Bryant nothing for winning what was almost the equivalent of a National Championship during that era. That was when UK made the decision that basketball would be the number one sport at UK and the rest is historyl. I think I have that right but am sure Wildcat Bill will know the full story. I think the quarterback for the UK football team was Babe Parilli. Bill, you and I go a long way back in UK sports.
The following are UK bowl teams from 1947 to current obtained from the UK Athletics site:
Overall Bowl Record: 8-7
Date
Bowl
Result
Dec. 6, 1947
1947 Great Lakes Bowl
Kentucky 24, Villanova 14
Jan. 2, 1950
1950 Orange Bowl
Santa Clara 21, Kentucky 13
Jan. 1, 1951
1951 Sugar Bowl
Kentucky 13, Oklahoma 7
Jan. 1, 1952
1952 Cotton Bowl
Kentucky 20, TCU 7
Dec. 31, 1976
1976 Peach Bowl
Kentucky 21, N. Carolina 0
Dec. 22, 1983
1983 Hall of Fame Bowl
W. Virginia 20, Kentucky 16
Dec. 29, 1984
1984 Hall of Fame Bowl
Kentucky 20, Wisconsin 19
Dec. 31, 1993
1993 Peach Bowl
Clemson 14, Kentucky 13
Jan. 1, 1999
1999 Outback Bowl
Penn State 26, Kentucky 14
Dec. 29, 1999
1999 HomePoint.com Music City Bowl
Syracuse 20, Kentucky 13
Dec. 29, 2006
2006 Gaylord Hotels Music City Bowl
Kentucky 28, Clemson 20
Dec. 31, 2007
2007 Gaylord Hotels Music City Bowl
Kentucky 35, Florida State 28
Jan. 2, 2009
2009 AutoZone Liberty Bowl
Kentucky 25, East Carolina 19
Dec. 29, 2009
2009 Gaylord Hotels Music City Bowl
Clemson 21, Kentucky 13
Jan. 8, 2011
2011 BBVA Compass Bowl
Pitt 27, Kentucky 10
We had pretty good football recognition in the late forties and early fifties as you can see from that bowl record, in an era when only a few teams got bowl appearances.
Coaches from the late forties and fifties and their records:
1946-53 Paul Bryant (Alabama) 8 60 23 5 .710
1954-61 Blanton Collier (Georgetown) 8 41 36 3 .531
From Wakipedia on Bear Bryant at UK:
Under Bryant the Wildcats won the 1947 Great Lakes Bowl, lost the 1950 Orange Bowl, won the 1951 Sugar Bowl and the 1952 Cotton Bowl Classic. In final AP polls, the Wildcats were ranked #11 in 1949, #7 in 1950, #15 in 1951, #20 in 1952 and #16 in 1953. The final 1950 poll was taken prior to the bowl games; Kentucky then defeated undefeated and #1 ranked Oklahoma in the Sugar Bowl, ending the Sooners 31 game winning streak. The NCAA does not recognized Kentucky as their 1950 co-national champion in football after commissioning Jeff Sagarin to apply his rankings to seasons before the advent of the Bowl Coalition.
[ 01-31-2012, 04:31 PM: Message edited by: SCWC ]
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catmandoo
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posted 01-31-2012 11:24 AM
Ray, The Cats scored 10 points against Pittsburg in the 2011 Compass bowl.
It should be noted too that Rich Brooks record was horrible utill he made a change and hired Joker Phillips as his offensive cooridinator for the 2005 season and they immediately turned things around with a 8-5 season. They never had a losing season with Joker as the offensive coordinator. How many Kentucky offensive coordinators can say that?
It also should be noted that out of the the 15 bowls that Kentucky has played in over "65" years Joker was the offensive coordinator or played in 7 of those bowl games. That should mean something to all Kentucky fans. He was born in Kentucky and has given Kentucky and their fans a huge part of his life and the ones who think he should be fired should be ashamed. Joker Phillips is a man of honor and principals. If he felt he was hurting the program he would be the first to admit it and leave on his own accord.
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SCWC
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posted 01-31-2012 04:25 PM
All I know about the state of UK football is that is has certainly gone down hill once again since Joker took over as head coach two seasons ago.
I had cut and pasted the bowl scores from the UK Athletics site, did not realize I had apparently left off the Pitt/UK score on the last bowl game.
[ 01-31-2012, 04:33 PM: Message edited by: SCWC ]
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catmandoo
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posted 01-31-2012 05:58 PM
Ray, Joker has been the head coach for 2 years with records of 6-7 and 5-7.
Here is Rich Brooks record at Kentucky for 3 years and few comments were made to fire him. In fact he was given a third and 4th year after going 6-17 for 2 seasons. I can't even imagine the heat and crap Joker would have gone through if he had gone 6-17 and would bet he would be long gone by now. Then to make matters worse Brooks gets a 3rd year and goes 3-8 for a total of 9-25 for 3 years.
2003 Kentucky 4–8 1–7 6th (East)
2004 Kentucky 2–9 1–7 5th (East)
2005 Kentucky 3–8 2–6 6th (East
Joker had 11 wins in his first 2 years compared to 9 wins for Brooks in 3 years. The question is why are so many fans after Joker's hide when Brooks got off so easy and was given more time as head coach?
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SCWC
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posted 02-02-2012 05:31 AM
The big difference between Joker and Brooks is that Brooks inherited little to no talent and he left Joker with several very skilled players to start his tenure as head coach with, Cobb, Locke, Hartline etc.
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catmandoo
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posted 02-02-2012 07:52 AM
We will never be a force in the SEC until we get better recruits. This year we did get a pretty good class which was rated from 31s best to around 50. It isn't going to make a lot of differance because every other SEC school is ranked higher. This isn't alot different than any other year from the past. To be honest it probably won't change in the future, i know it won't in my life time and doubt if Vince Lombardi was alive and coaching the Cats it wouldn't be much better.
With that said i know i will still be cheering for the Blue and White and the coachs as that is what the Kentucky faithful do.
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SCWC
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posted 02-02-2012 05:22 PM
I see that Alabama got the number one rated class and Georgia and Florida were both within the top six. You are right, we will never be able to compete consistently in football until we find some way to recruit with the schools that are major football powers.
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ukcatfannfl
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posted 02-02-2012 10:26 PM
The ONLY way we can recruit is to buy a "big name" coach i.e. Cal et al. The university does NOT care enough about football to do that and as long as that mentaility is out there we will be a bottom dweller in the SEC.
Bring in a Urban Meyer - Lou Saban - Les Miles pay them whatever the going rate is - give them 5 years and we will up up and away. (the right amount of money will buy someone imo)
I like Joker and knew and liked Brooks but Brooks himself moved away from Lex in part to not having the University buy in to what he wanted to do and Joker firing all his staff and basically then going 2 yrs of bad football with a QB that is not SEC caliber in my opinion.
Sorry but that is the way I see it - in fact look at our history of football coaches - a dismal lot to say the least - or in Claiborns case after his prime and that loser from Ala and the loser from Valdosta. Then they let one go that had a 7-5 record cause they wouldnt pay him what Baylor (I think) offered.
Gents that is ky football -
listened to and watched for over 50 years and sameo sameo every year.
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ukcatfannfl
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catmandoo
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posted 02-03-2012 08:49 AM
Ray Exactly, and why would a big name coach jeoprdise his future by taking a chance on a team with our background in by far the toughest and deepest league in the country. It would take a bundle of money and doubt that would do it unless it was a older coach. To be honest the Kentucky job has to be one of in not toughest coaching jobs in the country. One other thing coach better be Caucasion or or he his no chance in He$$ with a good portion of the fan base. Sad but true.
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ukcatfannfl
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posted 02-03-2012 11:36 AM
Bruce - I respectfully disagree with you on the "color" remark. Ky fans want a winner - doesn't matter if he is black - blue - etc etc.
If as you say a big name coach wouldn't come to ky then how about an "up and comm-er" like Urban Meyer from Utah to Fl. Our search committees do not even try to come up with a coach that can improve the program. Brooks was an AD friend and Joker an "in state" man.
No, ky football is where it is because of what Wildcat Bill said - it's all basketball not football. Surely you can see that?
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ukcatfannfl
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Tiptree
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posted 02-03-2012 01:36 PM
Go and 'buy' Mike Leach. He would bring an exciting style of football, which in turn would lure top-drawer recruits. Mike Leach is what Hal Mumme wanted to be -- a great offensive mind that understands that you have to play defense, too...
Such a hire would make an immediate difference, and set us up to contend for the SEC championship within 4-6 years.
But, Joker hasn't 'earned' a rapid termination. I hope he can right the ship and continue to build on what Brooks built.
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catmandoo
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posted 02-03-2012 04:13 PM
TT, that would be fair, 4-6 years and that's what Joker should get. Brooks after 3 years was 9-25 and he stayed.
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boomdaddy
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posted 02-04-2012 02:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by catmandoo:
TT, that would be fair, 4-6 years and that's what Joker should get. Brooks after 3 years was 9-25 and he stayed.
Joker started with a better program than Brooks did. That is why the natives are restless. He turned over Brooks' staff and is not showing positive results from it. He had better show something this year. I am rooting for him.....but coaches get judged on wins and losses...and Joker did not inherit the mess that Brooks did. Last season's offense was horrendous. I thought, at the very least, that he would get a new OC to pump some life in the offense. He didn't. He will rise up or crash and burn, depending on the outcome of this season.
[ 02-05-2012, 05:52 AM: Message edited by: boomdaddy ]
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catmandoo
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posted 02-04-2012 04:39 PM
boom, when Brooks was having problems and the awfull start he brought Joker in to help with the recruiting and be the offensive coordinator. That is when Kentucky turned it around and started winning. I doubt few will give Joker credit for what he was able to accomplish but would bet coach Brooks being the class act he was would verify Joker's role in the turn around.
[ 02-04-2012, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: catmandoo ]
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ukcatfannfl
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posted 02-04-2012 09:04 PM
I wouldnt bet on that Bruce - he is not too fond of Ky and the coacing staff i.e. Joker
Again main reason he left KY. Joker didnt want to build on what Brooks left but instead to totally revamp the team which has given us the past two yrs plus the bowl game we got destroyed in.
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ukcatfannfl
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boomdaddy
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posted 02-05-2012 06:22 AM
Joker obtained his spot as head coach, because Brooks gave him the opporunity as an Offensive Coordinator. He performed very well in that capacity and helped Brooks get to respectability, winning enough games to go to the lower bowls. This was a huge accomplishment, because they hadn't gone bowling in a really long time.
Here is what transpired, that gave Joker the job of OC. Brooks had another bad season and his offense was terrible. The athletic director told Brooks to fire his OC and get a new one. Brooks made a statement in the press that basically stated: If he goes, I go. A day or two later, Brooks fired his OC and promoted Joker.
For the life of me, I don't understand why this did not happen this time around? I feel that Joker is too close to the situation and thinks that they can fix the problem internally. Imho, Barnhart should have stepped in and given Joker the same mandate that he gave Brooks.
Not only was the offense sub par most of the season, they showed a total lack of execution on very simple plays in a lot of games.
The pro style offense that Randy Sanders runs is predicated on the use of a very sharp QB that can quickly read defenses and change plays at the line of scrimmage. It may sound like a simple concept. But, for some reason, Sanders can't get his starting QB ready for the season, much less have a capable back up, if the starter goes down.
Joker is not running the offense now, Sanders is. It is not working and it appears that they are planning on doing the same thing they did last year. Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't that the definition of insanity?
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catmandoo
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posted 02-05-2012 07:42 AM
Phillips won more games than any first-year UK coach in our history since Blanton Collier in 1954. That's a fact and the second year he wins 5 games and "many" fans want him fired and gone. Why? None of the other coachs going back 50 years were treated that way. None!!!
Boom makes some good points as he does probably need some changes in his coaching staff but to fire him is just plain insanity. Collier, Bradshaw, Ray, Curci, Claiborne,Curry, Mumme, Morris and yes even Brooks were all had losing records and together they averaged 6 years of coaching the Cats before they were let go or left on their own accord. These are undisputable facts nothing more nothing less.
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boomdaddy
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posted 02-05-2012 07:59 AM
I am rooting for Joker and UK to do well. His hire at the DC position is paying off. He has to fix his offense. What gets put on the field is the responsibilty of the coaching staff and especially the head coach. I do not think Joker is stupid or ignorant. He was smart enough to put a good offense on the field, when he was promoted to offensive coordinator.
I hope they make changes in style and play calling philosophy as well. I think that their offense has gotten predictable. Maybe they should grab ten or fifteen plays from the film archives of the Mumme era and add some plays that other teams have used against them that they think worked really well.
Predictability will kill an offense, unless you execute flawlessly and match up well at the point of attack. Execution was in short supply, last season, and match ups are tough against most of the teams in the SEC.
[ 02-05-2012, 08:00 AM: Message edited by: boomdaddy ]
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catmandoo
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posted 02-05-2012 09:12 AM
Boom, all good points and believe he will make adjustments and hopefully they will work. Bottom line though you need players and even though he had a good recruiting year for our standards they are not nearly close to what the Bama, LSU Georgia, Arkansas, South Carolina, Florida, Tennesse and the rest of the SEC recruited.
I'm sure he will be gone in a year and expect the next coach will face the same thing that the coachs have faced for the past 50 plus years. I just hope whoever it is gets more support than what Joker has received.
[ 02-05-2012, 09:37 AM: Message edited by: catmandoo ]
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boomdaddy
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posted 02-05-2012 09:57 AM
If the offense is a repeat of last season, I say he should be gone. That doesn't mean he will be.
I hope he gets the offense on track and I sure as heck hope he talks about his team being the sisters of the poor, until they prove they can beat somebody. He killed himself by the big talk, before last season
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catmandoo
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posted 02-05-2012 10:05 AM
Boom, Do you honestly think trying to instill some positive thinking is bad? If your coachs don't support you and build you up who will? It sure won't be a big part of the fan base.
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boomdaddy
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posted 02-05-2012 10:21 AM
quote:
Originally posted by catmandoo:
Boom, Do you honestly think trying to instill some positive thinking is bad? If your coachs don't support you and build you up who will? It sure won't be a big part of the fan base.
I think Joker should tell his team that they have the ability to beat any team on their schedule if they execute their plays and each person does their job. But, when Joker talks to the press he should down play his team's chances. The only time to hooray is when you are doing a pepe rally or at a booster/alumni function. UL's coach told the press that his team didn't have a chance to best UK, last season. If he lost, he gets to say , I told you so. If he wins, he looks like a great coach.
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DT519M
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posted 02-05-2012 07:04 PM
Here's a thought,we are in the same spot in football as the rest of the mighty SEC is in basketball ,correct?
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catmandoo
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posted 02-06-2012 10:21 AM
DT, True, we have not won a outright SEC championship for over 60 years and that was the only outright championship ever.(1950)
We have never even won a divisional championship since that was started.
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